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Post by Ninmast on Jan 21, 2009 13:34:55 GMT -5
So did I, even though I thought I wasn't going to. Palin tipped the scales for me. When the presidential nominees are nearly identical, you look at their VPs.
Here's the million dollar, loaded question, though. Would he have won if he were not black?
While his skin color, unfortunately, did play a large part, as can be seen when you go out and ask in African-American populations, I think he still would have won. I have never seen a political party hold the office of President for more than two consecutive terms. Americans are finicky and demand results quickly. When they don't get what they want, they're quick to switch sides. In addition, Obama is an extremely talented public speaker and is incredibly charismatic. That's why I said back when we still had four candidates on either side, Obama would win. I held no confidence in a Republican victory.
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Post by Beanybag on Jan 21, 2009 19:59:59 GMT -5
He would have won if he were not black. The world was quick to turn on republicans for the problems of the world and look to the democrats. If it goes well for the democrats, they'll hold their place for maybe 4 terms, until things slip up a little bit, and then it's back to republicans.
A better question might have been would Obama have won the preliminary elections for the democratic candidate if Hilary wasn't a woman and he weren't black.
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shinaobi
Full Member
Oh yeah.
Posts: 499
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Post by shinaobi on Jan 21, 2009 20:19:51 GMT -5
If he wasn't black, he would have been shafted in the preliminaries. He pretty much got by by being a friendlier figure than Hillary and benefitting from some poorly done attack ads and the OH BY THE WAY I AM COLORED K THANKS card. Considering the closeness of the race until it got towards the end, it is my personal opinion that Hillary's qualifications could have beaten out an inexperienced Illinois senator.
Oh wait. There goes that theory.
But enough of my complainin'. I figure he should at least get a chance to try his hand at it; I haven't seen anything to prove that he CAN'T do it.
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Post by Ninmast on Jan 21, 2009 21:26:52 GMT -5
Well, there's his choice of company ...
But the only reason that there isn't any evidence that he CAN'T do it is the same reason there isn't any evidence that he CAN do it. Because he hasn't done anything yet ANYWHERE.
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zandyne
Full Member
This is NOT Zetsu. DX
Posts: 1,037
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Post by zandyne on Jan 21, 2009 22:25:35 GMT -5
Well, there's his choice of company ... But the only reason that there isn't any evidence that he CAN'T do it is the same reason there isn't any evidence that he CAN do it. Because he hasn't done anything yet ANYWHERE. My main issue with that is because of the whole he was a Senator but didn't do anything then out of the blue he starts talking big, and it wasn't like he wasn't a Senator for a substantial amount of time. *shrug* Well we'll see if the RRDRRD pattern holds true.
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Post by Ninmast on Jan 21, 2009 22:45:02 GMT -5
You confuzzle me, Zandyne. What's the RRDRRD pattern?
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zandyne
Full Member
This is NOT Zetsu. DX
Posts: 1,037
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Post by zandyne on Jan 21, 2009 23:00:08 GMT -5
RRDRRD = What the trend in presidents is for the most part of the history of the US, which seems to be Republican, Republican, Democrat and then back to Republican. I believe there was one exception, though I can't remember who though. I believe it was FDR though....
The overall pattern seems to come from the fact that 2-terms of 2 Republicans puts people in a bad mood, then 1 Democrat comes along and wins...and people are happy...up until they do their taxes then they swap back to Republican. *shrug*
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Post by Ninmast on Jan 21, 2009 23:32:36 GMT -5
Ah. Granted, my experience isn't very much, I only know back to George Bush Sr. But as far as I know, it's more RRDDRRDD.
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Post by mercyblowz on Jan 23, 2009 2:58:22 GMT -5
Y'know what's impressive about Obama? The impact he has had so far outside of the US. Here in the UK people sat up and took notice for pretty much the entire election process, from the beginning of the primaries to election night proper. That's a long time in politics. That's a very long time to be interested in what some suits are saying in another country.
There were a bunch of folks around my house drinking, gaming, just having a blast and people specifically asked to watch Obama's inauguration. That's a big deal.
As for the actual event. It was okay, I thought. His speech was quite a change in tone from his rhetoric on campaign, which is probably a good thing. He seems comfortable with the office and aware that he's going to have to back up his 'new politics' with action. I just hope he doesn't let you guys down as much as some people think he will. Seems a lot like the RFK you got a chance to elect.
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Son of Marth
Full Member
also known as Dark Samus
Posts: 1,043
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Post by Son of Marth on Jan 23, 2009 17:15:31 GMT -5
God I hope that pissed obama off as much as it did me. my schools band was invited to the innauguration. Hell, the man was at my school during the campaigne. if he really thinks like that, then im pissed. or perhaps hes being sarcastic? or maybe we missed some subliminal message that we mised. and yes im ranting so pay me no mind. Yes, Marth. That explains it perfectly. The pastor that Obama chose to represent him spiritually at his first step into office wasn't ACTUALLY claiming that nothing had changed in the last forty years. He couldn't. We must have missed something. Perhaps we should grab the footage and check for individual frames every sixty where the screen flashes, too quick for the human eye to notice, "We LOVE America! We don't think Whites are what's wrong with the world! Pay no attention to the man behind the curtain!" Oh, wait, we can't. It was live. I said not to pay attention to me
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zandyne
Full Member
This is NOT Zetsu. DX
Posts: 1,037
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Post by zandyne on Jan 23, 2009 22:53:35 GMT -5
Y'know what's impressive about Obama? The impact he has had so far outside of the US. Here in the UK people sat up and took notice for pretty much the entire election process, from the beginning of the primaries to election night proper. That's a long time in politics. That's a very long time to be interested in what some suits are saying in another country. There were a bunch of folks around my house drinking, gaming, just having a blast and people specifically asked to watch Obama's inauguration. That's a big deal. As for the actual event. It was okay, I thought. His speech was quite a change in tone from his rhetoric on campaign, which is probably a good thing. He seems comfortable with the office and aware that he's going to have to back up his 'new politics' with action. I just hope he doesn't let you guys down as much as some people think he will. Seems a lot like the RFK you got a chance to elect. Of course people are interested, in a political sense he's like a slab of fresh meat and who's to say people from other nations aren't in any way prejudiced (age, race, party, ideals, etc.) I think the only reason why people paid so much attention is perhaps because they originally thought those of a different ethnicity couldn't become president (which is untrue) but suddenly someone "different" is up on the platform. I respect him for his planning and strategy concerning the election (in that regard he is well versed) but what irks me is his lack of willingness to share his political-experience history. There are some ideals I don't quite agree with but those would be a difference in creeds. And besides it's all up to Congress pulling the strings now. c_c
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Post by Ninmast on Jan 25, 2009 0:02:30 GMT -5
Please don't misunderstand me when I say this, Mercy, I understand his popularity worldwide, but he's our president, not yours.
Let me explain what I mean by that. It no doubt sounds as if I am slighting you for liking Obama, but it's the other way around. I'm slighting Obama for liking you. He rolled across the world with an almost rock star persona, gathering fame, interest, publicity and popularity, but he was running for President of the United States, not Emperor of the World. When he's running for president wanting us to elect him, he should be worried about us. He should be here talking to us. The rest of the world doesn't vote for him and the rest of the world doesn't sign his pay check. We do.
Of course, it seems like fewer and fewer politicians are remembering that while everyone else is shoving money in their face that our ridiculously taxed dollars can't match ...
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Post by mercyblowz on Jan 25, 2009 11:55:01 GMT -5
Nin, it's interesting you should feel that way. I guess that's a common opinion in the states, and it doesn't suprise me. Now from the rest of the world it always seemed that Obama's focus was on the US and most importantly the people who make up the United States. However it was also clear that he understood that the US was part of a larger world and that as a potential president of one of the most influentual countries in the world whatever he did would have an impact beyond the borders of America. The two greatest problems facing his administration are the economy and the fallout of previous foreign policy both of which are intimately connected to the outside world. Sure, the President of the USA has to put the interests of the citizens of the USA first, but having a leader that the rest of the world likes can't be a bad thing, right?
Also your taxes aren't ridiculous, trust me on that. What is ridiculous is the failure of the government to spend it's tax money sensibly and efficiently where it is really needed.
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Post by Ninmast on Jan 25, 2009 21:06:16 GMT -5
Yeah, the latter on the taxes is what I was referring to. Where our money is going, not how much is being taken.
You're right, having a president that the rest of the world likes is most definitely a good thing, and it's good to hear that such was the impression he gave. We just felt a little slighted because he's running a campaign to get elected, and he's flying to Europe. I suppose we're used to having our leaders close, relatively speaking.
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Post by The Silent Orator on Feb 3, 2009 9:05:15 GMT -5
I watched the inaguration. I was at work, but I watched it. My boss was a die-hard republican/conservative so I heard a lot of his opinions about it.
"So, he made his inagural speech. Economy fixed yet? Nope! He's now president. Is the war over? Nope! I don't see this change yet."
I personally loved his inagural speech. To be honest, though, I disagree with a lot of his policies, but I still respect the guy. That says a lot about his character.
It shows good character: -When people who don't like his policies can still respect him as an honest person and a respectable person in ovvice. -When people overseas cheer for him (you should hear what someone I know said about London people celebrating more than people here). -When so many people showed up at his inaguration. -When he was able to garner bi-partistan support. -When his first actions in office were to try to cut wages of government officials.
Obama's no FDR and for that, I'm eternally thankful.
And sure, maybe his skin color helped him get into office, but if that was a major factor, then I think something else stopped Al Sharpton (sp?) from getting in.
I won't digress any further... I'm not as politically minded as I used to be.
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